But qmail toaster are not easy to install But I have worked with servers several years -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Jad Wauthier Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 kl 5:47 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Thanks! On 7/28/2015 9:44 PM, mattias jonsson wrote:

Exist google apps anymore? Depends on the linux system Hm lets see Centos: qmail toaster Vpostmaster discontinued but still aavaiable On debian you can install courier

-----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Jad Wauthier Skickat: den 28 juli 2015 kl 23:49 Till: Blind sysadmins list<blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

What are the specific challenges you faced? The system is running CentOS 6.5. I don't need anything enterprise level or even really fancy. I just need it to be fairly solid and decently pretty. Easy to navigate with a screen reader would be nice too. On 7/28/2015 10:50 PM, mattias jonsson wrote:

But qmail toaster are not easy to install But I have worked with servers several years

-----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Jad Wauthier Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 kl 5:47 Till: Blind sysadmins list<blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Thanks!

On 7/28/2015 9:44 PM, mattias jonsson wrote:

...

Exist google apps anymore? Depends on the linux system Hm lets see Centos: qmail toaster Vpostmaster discontinued but still aavaiable On debian you can install courier

-----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Jad Wauthier Skickat: den 28 juli 2015 kl 23:49 Till: Blind sysadmins list<blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

---

Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Not remember if the old vpostmaster will work -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Jad Wauthier Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 kl 5:58 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What are the specific challenges you faced? The system is running CentOS 6.5. I don't need anything enterprise level or even really fancy. I just need it to be fairly solid and decently pretty. Easy to navigate with a screen reader would be nice too. On 7/28/2015 10:50 PM, mattias jonsson wrote:

But qmail toaster are not easy to install But I have worked with servers several years

-----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Jad Wauthier Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 kl 5:47 Till: Blind sysadmins list<blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Thanks!

On 7/28/2015 9:44 PM, mattias jonsson wrote:

...

Exist google apps anymore? Depends on the linux system Hm lets see Centos: qmail toaster Vpostmaster discontinued but still aavaiable On debian you can install courier

-----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Jad Wauthier Skickat: den 28 juli 2015 kl 23:49 Till: Blind sysadmins list<blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

---

Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi, I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

No you cant completely disable spam filter in office 365 But you can in a own server Or have I missed something? -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Andrew Hodgson Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 13:12 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi, You can set the mails to pass through and not mark as spam if you want. You can't take the spam filtering out of the equasion altogether. Of course with Office 365 you can't completely re-engineer the service but I was surprised what you are able to do. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 12:14 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers No you cant completely disable spam filter in office 365 But you can in a own server Or have I missed something? -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Andrew Hodgson Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 13:12 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi, I found the plans page for Exchange with Microsoft https://products.office.com/en-gb/exchange/compare-microsoft-exchange-online... I'm going to look into this. I've been with SMS for years, but if I can get what I have for cheaper with a bit of admin on my behalf it might be worth it. Barry -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 12:12 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi Andrew, How easy was it to migrate over including your domains as I've never done this before. I've always moved hosted providers and had them do it for me. All I've had to do was get them my MX Record address or something. Cheers, Barry. -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 18:09 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, It is worth it trust me. You can control everything yourself, be on the latest Exchange version, as well as have access to Office (if you purchase the right plan) and drive storage space etc. I couldn't live without it now. Andrew. -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Barry Toner Sent: 29 July 2015 17:03 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I found the plans page for Exchange with Microsoft https://products.office.com/en-gb/exchange/compare-microsoft-exchange-online... I'm going to look into this. I've been with SMS for years, but if I can get what I have for cheaper with a bit of admin on my behalf it might be worth it. Barry -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 12:12 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi, Your migration may be more complex as the domain nameservers are held at Simply Mail Solutions. Are they registering them as well (still have limited Broadband here so can't look up at present). If so, it may be worth looking at domain providers who give you control over the DNS so it can all be done by yourself. Andrew. -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Barry Toner Sent: 29 July 2015 19:12 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi Andrew, How easy was it to migrate over including your domains as I've never done this before. I've always moved hosted providers and had them do it for me. All I've had to do was get them my MX Record address or something. Cheers, Barry. -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 18:09 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, It is worth it trust me. You can control everything yourself, be on the latest Exchange version, as well as have access to Office (if you purchase the right plan) and drive storage space etc. I couldn't live without it now. Andrew. -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Barry Toner Sent: 29 July 2015 17:03 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I found the plans page for Exchange with Microsoft https://products.office.com/en-gb/exchange/compare-microsoft-exchange-online... I'm going to look into this. I've been with SMS for years, but if I can get what I have for cheaper with a bit of admin on my behalf it might be worth it. Barry -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 12:12 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Totally second what Andrew is saying with Office 365. I admit I’m not a huge fan of the web admin interface, but its more clunky with a screen reader than inaccessible with one. And everything you can do with the web UI you can do with Powershell, so there’s a CLI for everything. In fact, I think you can only do some of the more advanced tasks with Powershell. I’m not a huge fan of Onedrive for business, again not so much accessibility (the IOS could use some work) but it just doesn’t seem all that stable to me, but hey. At work we use a provider called Intermedia for our email, and very soon, Skype for Business. I think a mailbox alone with Intermedia is about $15 per person, which is about twice as much as I pay with Office 365, and you have very little control over the environment, all you can do with anti spam, for example, is set whether its on or off, and whitelist addresses and domains. With Intermedia’s Skype for Business you can’t even establish your own federation policies, you have to open support tickets for them to do that for you where with my Office 365 I was able to set up federation like I wanted to really easily. Ryan

On Jul 29, 2015, at 11:08 AM, Andrew Hodgson <andrew@hodgsonfamily.org> wrote:

Hi,

It is worth it trust me. You can control everything yourself, be on the latest Exchange version, as well as have access to Office (if you purchase the right plan) and drive storage space etc. I couldn't live without it now.

Andrew.

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Barry Toner Sent: 29 July 2015 17:03 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

I found the plans page for Exchange with Microsoft https://products.office.com/en-gb/exchange/compare-microsoft-exchange-online...

I'm going to look into this. I've been with SMS for years, but if I can get what I have for cheaper with a bit of admin on my behalf it might be worth it.

Barry

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 12:12 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc.

Andrew.

________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Because you have full control with a own mail server

-----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Just to emphasize something that Andrew said:

Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment.

I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth.

I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions.

I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility.

I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well.

The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are:

1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance.

2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance.

I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based.

I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them.

I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong.

So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over.

It's great fun!

Sorry for the lengthy response.

Darragh

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas:

You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really.

You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience.

You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality

Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining.

Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Litle ot but anyway What are the differences between the normal skype and skype for business -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Ryan Shugart Skickat: den 30 juli 2015 02:43 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Totally second what Andrew is saying with Office 365. I admit I'm not a huge fan of the web admin interface, but its more clunky with a screen reader than inaccessible with one. And everything you can do with the web UI you can do with Powershell, so there's a CLI for everything. In fact, I think you can only do some of the more advanced tasks with Powershell. I'm not a huge fan of Onedrive for business, again not so much accessibility (the IOS could use some work) but it just doesn't seem all that stable to me, but hey. At work we use a provider called Intermedia for our email, and very soon, Skype for Business. I think a mailbox alone with Intermedia is about $15 per person, which is about twice as much as I pay with Office 365, and you have very little control over the environment, all you can do with anti spam, for example, is set whether its on or off, and whitelist addresses and domains. With Intermedia's Skype for Business you can't even establish your own federation policies, you have to open support tickets for them to do that for you where with my Office 365 I was able to set up federation like I wanted to really easily. Ryan

On Jul 29, 2015, at 11:08 AM, Andrew Hodgson <andrew@hodgsonfamily.org> wrote:

Hi,

It is worth it trust me. You can control everything yourself, be on the latest Exchange version, as well as have access to Office (if you purchase the right plan) and drive storage space etc. I couldn't live without it now.

Andrew.

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Barry Toner Sent: 29 July 2015 17:03 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

I found the plans page for Exchange with Microsoft https://products.office.com/en-gb/exchange/compare-microsoft-exchange-online...

I'm going to look into this. I've been with SMS for years, but if I can get what I have for cheaper with a bit of admin on my behalf it might be worth it.

Barry

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 12:12 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc.

Andrew.

________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Because you have full control with a own mail server

-----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Just to emphasize something that Andrew said:

Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment.

I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth.

I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions.

I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility.

I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well.

The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are:

1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance.

2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance.

I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based.

I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them.

I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong.

So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over.

It's great fun!

Sorry for the lengthy response.

Darragh

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas:

You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really.

You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience.

You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality

Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining.

Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi, It is worth it trust me. You can control everything yourself, be on the latest Exchange version, as well as have access to Office (if you purchase the right plan) and drive storage space etc. I couldn't live without it now. Andrew. -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Barry Toner Sent: 29 July 2015 17:03 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I found the plans page for Exchange with Microsoft https://products.office.com/en-gb/exchange/compare-microsoft-exchange-online... I'm going to look into this. I've been with SMS for years, but if I can get what I have for cheaper with a bit of admin on my behalf it might be worth it. Barry -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 12:12 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I have pretty much full control with Office 365, actually. You would be surprised what you get control over from Office 365 - pretty much most of the Exchange features and even most of the SMTP-time features, antispam etc. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of mattias jonsson [mj@mjw.se] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:36 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Because you have full control with a own mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Darragh Ó Héiligh Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 11:34 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Darragh, Thank you for the info. You bring up really good points. This is my first time running the show from an admin perspective, so I'm open to all input. I definitely get that sometimes, it's better to let someone else do it for you, and sometimes, it's better to do it yourself. It takes experience to know which is the right option in a given situation. Which free professional email services would you suggest? Thanks again for the advice. --------- Jad wauthier | Problem Solver 512.743.9332 It's all in the perception. Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 29, 2015, at 04:34, Darragh Ó Héiligh <d@digitaldarragh.com> wrote:

Just to emphasize something that Andrew said:

Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment.

I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth.

I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions.

I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility.

I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well.

The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are:

1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance.

2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance.

I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based.

I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them.

I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong.

So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over.

It's great fun!

Sorry for the lengthy response.

Darragh

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas:

You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really.

You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience.

You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality

Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining.

Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Agree. I also run office 365 exchange and love it But I hate the admin interface -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Andrew Hodgson Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 13:11 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I agree with everything you said. I used Simply Mail Solutions, then migrated everything to Office 365. I didn't have a bad experience with SMS, but just thought it would be better to have Exchange hosting with Microsoft then a third party company. I have 3 main email accounts now including my work email account which is for a large retailer in the UK, and they are all on Office 365. Of course I still run my own mail system for this list and some other automated mail submission stuff, but for my own user mailbox I used Exchange back in 2004 when I was training myself, and I would never use anything different now. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Darragh Ó Héiligh [d@digitaldarragh.com] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:34 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi. I ran my own for years but gave up on it for many of the same reasons others have echoed. spam filtering, rdns records when I was running things out of home even with static ips, constant up time etc. I haven't used exchange in a long time. When I did, the server itself I found fairly difficult to admin but this was a long time ago and I suspect it has gotten much better. When I ran one for work, it was running on an nt4 server which gives an indication of the time frame and log files used to fill up the disk etc. I actually didn't know one could get exchange with 365. I will have to investigate as this might be a useful alternative to imap things for some people. Don't need to do this stuff for work anymore as the ONtario government has a whole team for their exchange servers but still like to keep my hand in. Shall do some digging. Brian. Contact me on skype: brian.moore follow me on twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bmoore123 On 07/29/2015 7:10 AM, Andrew Hodgson wrote:

Hi,

I agree with everything you said. I used Simply Mail Solutions, then migrated everything to Office 365. I didn't have a bad experience with SMS, but just thought it would be better to have Exchange hosting with Microsoft then a third party company. I have 3 main email accounts now including my work email account which is for a large retailer in the UK, and they are all on Office 365.

Of course I still run my own mail system for this list and some other automated mail submission stuff, but for my own user mailbox I used Exchange back in 2004 when I was training myself, and I would never use anything different now.

Andrew.

________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Darragh Ó Héiligh [d@digitaldarragh.com] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:34 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Just to emphasize something that Andrew said:

Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment.

I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth.

I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions.

I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility.

I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well.

The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are:

1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance.

2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance.

I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based.

I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them.

I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong.

So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over.

It's great fun!

Sorry for the lengthy response.

Darragh

-----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

Hi,

There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas:

You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really.

You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience.

You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality

Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining.

Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Hi Andrew, How does Office 365 with Exchange compare in terms of pricing compared to SMS? All I need is two mailboxes on the same domain and I' think I'm paying around £70 a year all in with SMS. Barry. -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 12:11 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, I agree with everything you said. I used Simply Mail Solutions, then migrated everything to Office 365. I didn't have a bad experience with SMS, but just thought it would be better to have Exchange hosting with Microsoft then a third party company. I have 3 main email accounts now including my work email account which is for a large retailer in the UK, and they are all on Office 365. Of course I still run my own mail system for this list and some other automated mail submission stuff, but for my own user mailbox I used Exchange back in 2004 when I was training myself, and I would never use anything different now. Andrew. ________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Darragh Ó Héiligh [d@digitaldarragh.com] Sent: 29 July 2015 10:34 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Just to emphasize something that Andrew said: Why do you need a mail server? There are a lot of free, cheap and professional mail providers out there at the moment. I hosted my own mail servers for about ten years but I stopped about two years ago because it's a lot more hassle than it's worth. I've even started moving my customers over to cloud hosted solutions. I've been bitten a few times by cloud providers of course. I would no longer trust Simply Mail Solutions to hold a stone. Never mind my customers mail boxes for example. I've had good experiences with Google apps but I don't like POP or IMAP. My preferred option funnily enough at the moment is Office 365. There's just no beating it for price, reliability and even accessibility. I stay away from POP and IMAP in favour of Exchange and active sync. If you can't get mail in real time to a phone at the moment you may forget about it. Customers aren't interested. They don't want pull functionality. They want push. If they can get instant gratification from Facebook they expect it from their mail system as well. The biggest two draw backs of running your own mail server are: 1. Constant up time is needed. If your MX records are pointing to that server it needs to be up every day all year round. If you have two boxes and their load balanced then fantastic but you have more patching and more maintenance. 2. Anti-Spam. Spam is one of the biggest problems for a mail administrator. White list too much and it becomes unuseful. Don't and people moan because they had to click three times instead of once to release and open a message. Again, this requires patching and maintenance. I'm still running three on site mail systems at the moment. All three have front end servers thanks to the EFA project. All three are Exchange servers. Correction. I'm running a fourth which is Postfix and Squirrelmail based. I'm looking forward to their renewal dates because I'll be glad to get rid of them. I'm tired of tracing through log files looking for a message that someone said hasn't been delivered when I know full well that it's on the recipients side that something has gone wrong. So keep that in mind. You're not just setting up a mail server. Your taking on the administration of that server, people's mail clients, the anti-spam, anti-virus and message delivery to companies that you have no control over. It's great fun! Sorry for the lengthy response. Darragh -----Original Message----- From: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Hodgson Sent: 29 July 2015 08:46 To: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Subject: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers Hi, There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas: You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really. You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience. You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining. Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore. -- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception. _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

Thank you for the response. It's very helpful. I've used Zimbra as an end user, but I've never tried to configure it. --------- Jad wauthier | Problem Solver 512.743.9332 It's all in the perception. Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 29, 2015, at 02:45, Andrew Hodgson <andrew@hodgsonfamily.org> wrote:

Hi,

There are a few specific paths you could go down. Here are some ideas:

You could go with a more enterprise ready system and just use the free version. Something like Zimbra or the like have free versions which support basic POP3 and IMAP access, as well as a good webmail client. There is an install curve to get through but once you are there it provides a good backend web interface to configure the system. The packages tend to take over the system, so you couldn't use the server for anything else really.

You could just install your own packages from the Linux repository including for example Postfix/Exim, Courier, Squirrelmail, and perhaps a configuration tool like Webmin etc. This will involve initial configuration but will be a good learning experience.

You could use something like ISPConfig, Symbiosis or CPannel on the server to provide the email server functionality

Last but not least there are cheap email providers around that could also do this for you and then you wouldn't have a server to worry about maintaining.

Hope this helps. Andrew. .________________________________________ From: Blind-sysadmins [blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] on behalf of Jad Wauthier [jtwauthier@gmail.com] Sent: 28 July 2015 22:48 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end. I'm a bit bummed that Google Apps isn't free anymore.

-- Jad Wauthier | Problem Solver Phone: 512.290.3494 Fax: 512.367.5925 It's all in the perception.

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins

ah I forget this thanks and you have also axigen mail server -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Blind-sysadmins [mailto:blind-sysadmins-bounces@lists.hodgsonfamily.org] För Michal Dziwisz Skickat: den 29 juli 2015 14:41 Till: Blind sysadmins list <blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org> Ämne: Re: [Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers W temacie "[Blind-sysadmins] Email Servers" Jad Wauthier pisze:

What email server would you install on a Linux system for a client? I'm looking for something that has a nice webmail interface and is easily configured on the back-end.

At first, I realy agree with others that hosting our own e-mail server isn't an easy thing, and you realy should consider using dedicatedprovider, but if you realy have to host your own box, try this: http://www.iredmail.org/ -- Michał Dziwisz michal@dziwisz.net _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list Blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org https://lists.hodgsonfamily.org/listinfo/blind-sysadmins