Billy, I'm interested in having a look to see if we can resolve this in JAWS but can't figure out how I can get access to the required equipment. Any ideas of how to simulate it ? --Glen Glen Gordon VisperoT | Software Fellow 17757 US Highway 19 N, Suite 560, Clearwater, FL 33764 T 727-803-8000 F 727-803-8001 ggordon@vispero.com www.vispero.com -----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 10:54 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Hi Vick, I am using Chrome and Waterfox with no success. I think it is real time updating and it is quite agrivating. It will simply just crash the browser if I try to navigate around. Thanks, Billy -----Original Message----- From: vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:52 AM To: blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA I do know that Internet Explorer likes to lock up systems running screen readers these days. However it seems as if Firefox and Chrome are more forgiving. This is also true when pages have dynamic content. Vic Pereira Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046   Gestionnaire de Projet, Réseaux, sécurité et services numériques (RSSN) Services partagés Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tél. : 204-781-5046 -----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:49 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Hi All, I have an issue on multiple PC's where when I login to the Mikrotiks or UBNT equipment, it freezes the browser because the interface tables are dynamically updating and the screen readers can't seem to handle it. Do you have any suggestions besides doing this all in SSH? Thanks, Billy _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org

Hi Glen, Firstly I wanted to thank FS for calling out access to the availability of Slack access with the latest JFW. I had been wanting this for a long time but hadn't tried it since a year or so back when it was unusable. Following the recent release note, I downloaded and am using the app with similar access to that of the browser, but with the benefits the app gives. Not sure if there is any way of giving us a list of apps FS are working on with JFW but I found that very useful when I read it in the release notes. In terms of simulating web pages this is something I have been interested in for a while. I wanted to get better access to a project management tool (Trello) that we use in the company. I did email the UK distributor of JFW about this and gave them a long email about the experience I was having. They were unable to reproduce the issue, though to their credit they did set up an account and create a small board with a few cards. Our board has hundreds of cards on it in different stages and there is no way they could simulate that. I have managed to somewhat sort the issue by having very specific URLs I visit with search criteria that seriously limits the amount of cards the system returns, but the issue I am having (browser crashes and very slow responses) still exists to some extent. I am interested in finding a way we can somehow send info to the screen reader developers with our current browser state when we are experiencing issues, and this may even be of benefit to the browser developers as well. One obvious concern would be data privacy especially if interacting with a corporate system, but even having something available would be hugely beneficial. Andrew. -----Original Message----- From: Glen Gordon Sent: 14 August 2019 16:58 To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Billy, I'm interested in having a look to see if we can resolve this in JAWS but can't figure out how I can get access to the required equipment. Any ideas of how to simulate it ? --Glen Glen Gordon VisperoT | Software Fellow 17757 US Highway 19 N, Suite 560, Clearwater, FL 33764 T 727-803-8000 F 727-803-8001 ggordon@vispero.com www.vispero.com -----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 10:54 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Hi Vick, I am using Chrome and Waterfox with no success. I think it is real time updating and it is quite agrivating. It will simply just crash the browser if I try to navigate around. Thanks, Billy -----Original Message----- From: vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:52 AM To: blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA I do know that Internet Explorer likes to lock up systems running screen readers these days. However it seems as if Firefox and Chrome are more forgiving. This is also true when pages have dynamic content. Vic Pereira Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046   Gestionnaire de Projet, Réseaux, sécurité et services numériques (RSSN) Services partagés Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tél. : 204-781-5046 -----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:49 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Hi All, I have an issue on multiple PC's where when I login to the Mikrotiks or UBNT equipment, it freezes the browser because the interface tables are dynamically updating and the screen readers can't seem to handle it. Do you have any suggestions besides doing this all in SSH? Thanks, Billy _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org

Hi, In our office we have a few mikrotik products running RouterOS. I could do some tests if you want on Monday. I am using NVDA there. Just tell me how you did it so i can reproduce. Greetings, Simon Am 14.08.2019 um 18:13 schrieb vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca:

Hello Billy

Unfortunately, I have no idea how to temporarily suspend a webpage with NVDA. This was a valuable feature in Window-Eyes that came in handy more often than I can count when managing systems that continued to update areas of the screen via their web interfaces.

Hopefully someone on this list will come through for you.

Vic Pereira

Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046

Gestionnaire de Projet, Réseaux, sécurité et services numériques (RSSN) Services partagés Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tél. : 204-781-5046

-----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:54 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi Vick,

I am using Chrome and Waterfox with no success. I think it is real time updating and it is quite agrivating. It will simply just crash the browser if I try to navigate around.

Thanks,

Billy

-----Original Message----- From: vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:52 AM To: blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

I do know that Internet Explorer likes to lock up systems running screen readers these days. However it seems as if Firefox and Chrome are more forgiving. This is also true when pages have dynamic content.

Vic Pereira

Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046

Gestionnaire de Projet, Réseaux, sécurité et services numériques (RSSN) Services partagés Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tél. : 204-781-5046

-----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:49 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi All,

I have an issue on multiple PC's where when I login to the Mikrotiks or UBNT equipment, it freezes the browser because the interface tables are dynamically updating and the screen readers can't seem to handle it. Do you have any suggestions besides doing this all in SSH?

Thanks,

Billy _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org

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Would it be helpful if an archive of the traffic is provided for analysis? This page has instructions for creating archive files using multiple browsers and proxies, including Fiddler which I've found to be quite accessible: https://community.box.com/t5/Managing-Content-Troubleshooting/How-to-Generat... Firefox, Chrome, etc. save in .har (HTTP ARchive format). Information on this format is here: http://www.softwareishard.com/blog/har-12-spec/ Fiddler saves a .saz (Session Archive Zip) format. Information on this format is here: http://fiddler.wikidot.com/saz-files -----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:46 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Hi, You will have to have a network configured with a couple of devices on the device. After loggin into it, go through the config tree and click on Interfaces. This is where it will become an issue. Sometimes after the devices are setup... after login, it will automatically put you in the interfaces page which keeps you from getting to anywhere else because it freezes. Thanks, Billy -----Original Message----- From: Simon Eigeldinger Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 12:18 PM To: Blind sysadmins list ; vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Hi, In our office we have a few mikrotik products running RouterOS. I could do some tests if you want on Monday. I am using NVDA there. Just tell me how you did it so i can reproduce. Greetings, Simon Am 14.08.2019 um 18:13 schrieb vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca:

Hello Billy

Unfortunately, I have no idea how to temporarily suspend a webpage with NVDA. This was a valuable feature in Window-Eyes that came in handy more often than I can count when managing systems that continued to update areas of the screen via their web interfaces.

Hopefully someone on this list will come through for you.

Vic Pereira

Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046

Gestionnaire de Projet, Réseaux, sécurité et services numériques (RSSN) Services partagés Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tél. : 204-781-5046

-----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:54 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi Vick,

I am using Chrome and Waterfox with no success. I think it is real time updating and it is quite agrivating. It will simply just crash the browser if I try to navigate around.

Thanks,

Billy

-----Original Message----- From: vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:52 AM To: blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

I do know that Internet Explorer likes to lock up systems running screen readers these days. However it seems as if Firefox and Chrome are more forgiving. This is also true when pages have dynamic content.

Vic Pereira

Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046

Gestionnaire de Projet, Réseaux, sécurité et services numériques (RSSN) Services partagés Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tél. : 204-781-5046

-----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:49 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi All,

I have an issue on multiple PC's where when I login to the Mikrotiks or UBNT equipment, it freezes the browser because the interface tables are dynamically updating and the screen readers can't seem to handle it. Do you have any suggestions besides doing this all in SSH?

Thanks,

Billy _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org

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Billy, I understand what you're saying. If Vispero is unable to test with actual hardware, I thought they might be able to work with an archive of the traffic to recreate the series of responses for testing. Chris On Wed, Aug 14, 2019 at 06:20:19PM +0000, Billy Irwin wrote:

Hi Chris,

The issue isn't more about the traffic. It is because this is the screen where you can select which interface you wish to configure or add new ones.

Thanks,

Billy

-----Original Message----- From: Chris Nestrud Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 1:29 PM To: 'Blind sysadmins list' Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Would it be helpful if an archive of the traffic is provided for analysis?

This page has instructions for creating archive files using multiple browsers and proxies, including Fiddler which I've found to be quite accessible:

https://community.box.com/t5/Managing-Content-Troubleshooting/How-to-Generat...

Firefox, Chrome, etc. save in .har (HTTP ARchive format). Information on this format is here: http://www.softwareishard.com/blog/har-12-spec/

Fiddler saves a .saz (Session Archive Zip) format. Information on this format is here: http://fiddler.wikidot.com/saz-files

-----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:46 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi,

You will have to have a network configured with a couple of devices on the device. After loggin into it, go through the config tree and click on Interfaces. This is where it will become an issue. Sometimes after the devices are setup... after login, it will automatically put you in the interfaces page which keeps you from getting to anywhere else because it freezes.

Thanks,

Billy

-----Original Message----- From: Simon Eigeldinger Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 12:18 PM To: Blind sysadmins list ; vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi,

In our office we have a few mikrotik products running RouterOS.

I could do some tests if you want on Monday. I am using NVDA there. Just tell me how you did it so i can reproduce.

Greetings, Simon

Am 14.08.2019 um 18:13 schrieb vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca:

...

Hello Billy

Unfortunately, I have no idea how to temporarily suspend a webpage with NVDA. This was a valuable feature in Window-Eyes that came in handy more often than I can count when managing systems that continued to update areas of the screen via their web interfaces.

Hopefully someone on this list will come through for you.

Vic Pereira

Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046

Gestionnaire de Projet, R??seaux, s??curit?? et services num??riques (RSSN) Services partag??s Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / T??l. : 204-781-5046

-----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:54 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi Vick,

I am using Chrome and Waterfox with no success. I think it is real time updating and it is quite agrivating. It will simply just crash the browser if I try to navigate around.

Thanks,

Billy

-----Original Message----- From: vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2019 11:52 AM To: blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

I do know that Internet Explorer likes to lock up systems running screen readers these days. However it seems as if Firefox and Chrome are more forgiving. This is also true when pages have dynamic content.

Vic Pereira

Project Manager, Network, Security and Digital Services (NSDS) Shared Services Canada, Government of Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / Tel: 204-781-5046

Gestionnaire de Projet, R??seaux, s??curit?? et services num??riques (RSSN) Services partag??s Canada, Gouvernement du Canada vic.pereira@ssc-spc.gc.ca / T??l. : 204-781-5046

-----Original Message----- From: Billy Irwin Sent: August-14-19 10:49 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Hi All,

I have an issue on multiple PC's where when I login to the Mikrotiks or UBNT equipment, it freezes the browser because the interface tables are dynamically updating and the screen readers can't seem to handle it. Do you have any suggestions besides doing this all in SSH?

Thanks,

Billy _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org

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Have you reported to mikrotik? should be fixable. Greetings, Simon Am 21.08.2019 um 16:17 schrieb Billy Irwin:

Hi,

Yes, I am on the latest Windows 10 build. I am using the Edge Router Pro series and Mikrotik RB1100's. The are the higher in enterprise grade devices. Even the Edge router X is also doing the same thing. The pages are indeed accessible, but when you go to a page that has auto updating tables, it crashes all screen readers and browsers. I am going to at some point try voiceover. Not interested in using my iPhone to do advanced network config.

Best,

Billy

-----Original Message----- From: Samuel Barnes Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2019 7:22 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA

Are you on the latest version of Windows 10? Have you tried Narrator? It's gotten a lot better. Still not quite daily driver material, but I was able to install a bunch of software at work using it with few issues. What UBNT equipment are you using? I have a bunch of Unifi stuff at home and the web interface is more or less accessible. At least it's not freezing up like you're describing. If you are using Unifi try the mobile app, that's even better.

On Wed, Aug 14, 2019 at 10:51 AM Billy Irwin wrote:

...

Hi All,

I have an issue on multiple PC's where when I login to the Mikrotiks or UBNT equipment, it freezes the browser because the interface tables are dynamically updating and the screen readers can't seem to handle it. Do you have any suggestions besides doing this all in SSH?

Thanks,

Billy _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org

_______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org

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Hi Jason, They do have a CLI. I am experimenting with it, but I have a lot to do and a short amount of time. Screen readers really have a ways to go in dealing with things like this. Best, Billy -----Original Message----- From: Jason White via Blind-sysadmins Sent: Saturday, August 24, 2019 10:59 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Cc: Jason White Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Do they offer an ssh option and a command lie interface? If so, try using that for now. On 8/21/19, 10:18, "Billy Irwin" wrote: Hi, Yes, I am on the latest Windows 10 build. I am using the Edge Router Pro series and Mikrotik RB1100's. The are the higher in enterprise grade devices. Even the Edge router X is also doing the same thing. The pages are indeed accessible, but when you go to a page that has auto updating tables, it crashes all screen readers and browsers. I am going to at some point try voiceover. Not interested in using my iPhone to do advanced network config. Best, Billy -----Original Message----- From: Samuel Barnes Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2019 7:22 AM To: Blind sysadmins list Subject: [Blind-sysadmins] Re: Browser Issues with JAWS and NVDA Are you on the latest version of Windows 10? Have you tried Narrator? It's gotten a lot better. Still not quite daily driver material, but I was able to install a bunch of software at work using it with few issues. What UBNT equipment are you using? I have a bunch of Unifi stuff at home and the web interface is more or less accessible. At least it's not freezing up like you're describing. If you are using Unifi try the mobile app, that's even better. On Wed, Aug 14, 2019 at 10:51 AM Billy Irwin wrote: > Hi All, > > I have an issue on multiple PC's where when I login to the Mikrotiks > or UBNT equipment, it freezes the browser because the interface tables > are dynamically updating and the screen readers can't seem to handle > it. Do you have any suggestions besides doing this all in SSH? > > Thanks, > > Billy > _______________________________________________ > Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- > blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org > To unsubscribe send an email to > blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org > _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org _______________________________________________ Blind-sysadmins mailing list -- blind-sysadmins@lists.hodgsonfamily.org To unsubscribe send an email to blind-sysadmins-leave@lists.hodgsonfamily.org